Balancing Freedom and Safety: Alan Dershowitz on The Preventive State and the Cost of Speaking Out (Judean Rose)

The famed legal scholar discusses his magnum opus, The Preventive State, why he wrote it now, and why it may never reach the audience it deserves.

Alan Dershowitz calls The Preventive State his magnum opus—and for someone as prolific as he is, that’s saying something. Often referred to as “the world’s best-known lawyer,” Dershowitz has authored more than 50 books and over a thousand articles. But it’s clear why this latest work stands apart. In The Preventive State, he proposes a visionary jurisprudence designed not just to respond to harm, but to anticipate and avert it—be it something on the scale of World War II or the October 7 massacre.

At the heart of the book is an elegant and accessible framework: a four-quadrant matrix of true and false positives and negatives. With this structure, Dershowitz gives readers—experts and laypeople alike—a practical vocabulary for assessing risk and reimagining how the law might operate proactively rather than reactively. It’s a slim volume, yet it delivers a substantial punch, opening the door to a future where justice is not only fair but also preventative.

“You cannot prevent harm if you cannot predict it.” —Alan Dershowitz

Of course, any system that emphasizes prevention carries the risk of overreach—of stifling freedoms in the name of safety. The Preventive State doesn’t shy away from that danger. Instead, it makes the case for a jurisprudence that allows people to be both secure and free. But here’s the catch: the very person who authored this powerful and timely work has, to a large extent, been canceled.

As Dershowitz explains in the interview below, he doesn’t expect The Preventive State—his most important book to date—to receive a review in The New York Times. Why? Because the Times severed ties with him after he served on President Donald Trump’s legal team during the first impeachment trial in 2020. Since then, the once-reliable platform has ceased interviewing him and no longer covers his books.

“The New York Times will not review my most important book—because I defended Donald Trump.”

It’s a bitter irony: a book devoted to safeguarding democracy and civil liberties may be denied the public attention it deserves because its author remains unapologetically committed to due process—and to being, in his own words, an “outspoken Jewish Zionist.” That, perhaps more than anything, ensures his exclusion from today’s mainstream platforms.

More’s the pity.

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Varda Epstein: Your book is titled The Preventive State, which to some might sound authoritarian. How do you define it—and how would you distinguish it from totalitarian systems?

Alan Dershowitz: Well, prevention is good and authoritarianism is bad, and there’s the risk that trying to prevent will create authoritarianism. There's no way of the state engaging in preventive actions without diminishing certain liberties. Benjamin Franklin said those who would give up essential liberties for a little security deserved neither. But every government has always given up some liberties to assure great security. If any of us could have prevented 9/11, or October 7th, by arresting some people, even if we made some mistakes, we would have done it. You know, we went much too far after the Second World War began when President Roosevelt confined 110,000 Americans in detention centers in order to prevent one or two acts of treason, and none of them occurred. So, it’s the question of balancing, but if the balance is struck improperly, there is the potential for authoritarianism, of course. That’s why I worry about the preventive state. On the other hand, we’re always going to try to prevent. We’re never going to wait until cataclysmic harm occurs. Every country has to confront those issues. Israel’s confronting it right now with Iran. Should Israel go and prevent, as they did Iraq and Syria, from developing weapons? And the United States probably has a different view on that. So these are always the kind of balancing decisions that we have to make.

Varda Epstein: You described Abraham as the first lawyer. He pleaded with God to spare the innocent. Why would he choose to plead for the innocent over eradicating evil?

Alan Dershowitz: Because I think he understood that God could easily have come back and said, look, Abraham, I’m God. I know who’s guilty and who’s innocent. I’ll kill only the guilty and not the innocent. But God said he was going to kill everybody because there were so many guilty people, and Abraham was the first one to challenge authority by saying, no, you can’t overdo it. If you can’t separate the innocent from the guilty, you have to spare everybody. And then God comes back and basically says, yeah, but it depends how many innocent there are. And then that’s when the negotiation begins—50, 40, 30, 20, 10, stops at 10. And that’s been the number that we focus on in Anglo-American jurisprudence also, better ten guilty go free than one innocent be wrongly confined. So, you know, there are various concepts in the Bible that are instrumental in the preventive state. Obviously, Abraham’s argument with God; the idea of punishing recalcitrant children to make sure they don’t become dangerous adults; taking people who have contagious diseases and putting them in isolation; the concept of exile goes back thousands of years, and that’s what we’re doing now with deportation. Deportation is simply a form of exile.

Varda Epstein: I’d argue that it’s just following the law. I mean, if people are somewhere illegally, shouldn’t they be deported?

Alan Dershowitz: No, not necessarily. Some of my relatives came into this country to escape Nazism, and had false affidavits in order to get in because they couldn’t get in lawfully. So sometimes you have to understand, it depends on the circumstances. If you’re escaping from absolute brutality, the way they were escaping from Castro, you have a different rule than if they’re trying to just get some economic benefits. So, you know, the Torah has said, “Tzedek tzedek tirdof,” “Justice, justice” and why two justices? Well, you know, one is justice with compassion, and you have to have a little bit of compassion. But there’s a big difference between people who sneak in in order to commit crimes or in order to evade justice and people who come to save their lives.

Varda Epstein: You spoke in your book about how Great Britain and France could have prevented World War II had they enforced the Versailles Treaty early on, but you posited that perhaps they feared being seen as warmongers. Do you think that’s the main reason they didn’t act?

Alan Dershowitz: Yeah. I think they . . . first, I’m not sure they believed that Hitler would actually do these things. So this was an example of a false negative where there was evidence and information; they didn’t believe it, and they made a horrible mistake. They could have saved 50 million lives. And, you know, we may be making the same mistake now with Iran. If we believe that Iran is trying to develop nuclear weapons . . .

Varda Epstein: Do you think democratic leaders today still face this dilemma of being seen as warmongers, facing backlash for acting, so they hesitate, and they hesitate too long?

Alan Dershowitz: Well, I think some, it depends. You know, Israel would like to move preventively, as it has. Much of my book, The Preventive State, is based on what I call, or what has been called, the Begin Doctrine, that sometimes you just can’t wait to be attacked. You have to take preemptive and preventive action. Israel’s been a leader in that because it’s a tiny country; it’s very vulnerable; and it won’t kill innocent civilians needlessly; whereas other countries are less protective in their approach. So, I think there is the fear that the world would condemn them. There’s this idiotic International Criminal Court that selectively condemns only democracies, and I don’t think anybody should take seriously the International Criminal Court. I think it should be ignored and ended, but there are countries that, you know, England and France and others care about that.

Varda Epstein: At first after 9/11, Americans were pretty accepting of the extreme security measures that were taken, such as in airports with the creation of the TSA. You talked about society turning preventive to prevent terror, right? Then, as time goes on, the fear slips away, people forget, go back to normal, and no longer want these measures, resulting in pushback. Do you think October 7th produced a similar kind of shift among the Israeli left, rendering preventive measures more acceptable?

Alan Dershowitz: For a while, but many, many in the Israeli left have “BDS,” Bibi Derangement Syndrome. So, if Bibi’s doing it, it must be wrong, and many in the Israeli left are making terrible mistakes about how they deal with this issue. So, you know, the same thing is true in the United States with Trump Derangement Syndrome, and so there’s too much of personal issues involved, both in Israel and in the United States. Both have very controversial leaders, and the left can’t believe that they would do anything for positive reasons.

Varda Epstein: Yeah. I always think that the fact that American Jews voted for Kamala shows they hate Donald Trump more than they love Israel. That’s how I felt about that.

Alan Dershowitz: I would feel differently about that. I think they want to be more liberal than they want to be Jewish, and they’re willing to vote, not their Jewish values or their Jewish defense, but they want their friends to like them, and they want to be seen as progressive and liberal. And they vote against their own interests.

“They were killed because of Harvard. Because of Columbia. Because of the way antisemitism is taught.”

Varda Epstein: Let’s talk about the couple that was murdered last week, targeted because the attacker assumed they were Jewish. That’s antisemitic no matter their religion, right?

Alan Dershowitz: So, one was Jewish, the other was not. But it doesn’t matter. They were killed because, whether they were Jews or not, they were killed because they were Jews. And they were killed because of Harvard, and they were killed because of Columbia, and they were killed because of the way in which the Ivy League schools and many schools have been teaching, not just tolerating, but teaching antisemitism. When you teach intersectionality, when you teach DEI, when you teach critical race theory, you’re teaching antisemitism. And when you encourage people, the way Kamala Harris and Walz, the vice presidential candidate, encourage people to call for “Palestine will be free” and
“globalize the intifada,” you’re inciting murder. And so there’s a lot of blood on the hands of university administrators and politicians.

“I’m an outspoken Jewish Zionist, and that will never change.”

Varda Epstein: When should we limit speech? How far do we allow it to go? Do we allow them to say “from the river to the sea”? Do we punish it? Because maybe it would have prevented this?

Alan Dershowitz: No, in my book The Preventive State, I have a whole chapter on free speech and when it should be limited. I think the limitation has to be incitement towards speech. And when you stand in front of a large crowd and you yell, “Globalize the intifada,” that could be incitement. When you, however, just talk abstractly about Israel not existing, that’s hate speech, but it’s free speech. Hate speech is protected by the Constitution today. That may change. We may experience over the next years with this current Supreme Court, a cutting back a little bit of incitement and advocacy of violence. As we see more and more violence, look, I predicted in my writings, I predicted what happened in D.C. I predicted that, based on my experience in representing radical violent protesters back in the 1960s and 70s, and some of them went on to become terrorists. Kathy Boudin, who I helped represent, became a murderer and spent many years in prison. The Weathermen became murderers. They also became friends of Barack Obama. But these are people who Barack Obama befriended. These were people who were regarded as legitimate. But they turned into terrorists. And I think that’s going to happen here, too. I think supporters of Hamas, people who support Hamas and who advocate the end of Israel, which is what “from the river to the sea” and “globalize the intifada” means, there’s a risk that they may start killing Americans. You know, Jews are always the first, they’re the canary in the mine shaft, but as we see, it’s not always Jews that get killed, but there’s going to be more of that. I’ve had to redouble my own personal security.

Varda Epstein: Yeah. I saw you on Hannity.

Alan Dershowitz: It’s true. I’ve always had some threats on my life, so I’ve been concerned about security. But when I spoke just the other day at a college in Florida, I got an honorary doctorate, and they had to have armed guards around me. They had to have a whole process in place for what happens if somebody tried to attack me. They gave me instructions of how do I leave, and will there be bulletproof glass in front of me, and all of that. So, as a result of what happened in this group at Columbia, I’ve had to redouble my own personal security because I’m an outspoken Jewish Zionist, and that will never change.

Varda Epstein: I wanted to talk about the false positive that was your swatting incident that happened to you and your wife. It was a horrible thing, obviously traumatic, but you said it was the right thing. They made the right move.

Alan Dershowitz: Oh, of course. They got a call. They said that there was violence going on in my house. It was, you know, middle of the night, banging on the door, “If you don’t open the door, we’ll break it down.” And they came in with their guns drawn, and they could have easily shot somebody if I had made the wrong move. I was half asleep, I was getting up, and it was a very, very dangerous situation. It was quite deliberate, and we’re going to see more of that. We’re going to see much, much more violence. That, of course, is illegal, but you have to catch the person. And in my case, they haven’t caught the person who did this because it’s very easy to place an anonymous 911 call, and thankfully, the police respond to all these calls. Soon they’ll stop, because they’ll say they’re false alarms, and that will hurt the people who are really in trouble. I have a friend, a policeman who was killed in a domestic violence shootout, because he wouldn’t take the first shot to kill the person who was holding the woman hostage, because he was afraid he would kill her. And then he was shot and was killed. These kinds of situations, swats and everything, are very, very dangerous and have to be taken much more seriously than they’ve been taken.

Varda Epstein: And we need to make some kind of protocol according to your book. Okay, so on the other side of that, then, would be a false negative and preventable harm. So, what’s an example of one that stands out to you as a devastating false negative, what should have been caught?

Alan Dershowitz: The worst, of course, was World War II, the greatest example in history of a false negative. I would say after that, probably 9/11, October 7th, they could have been caught. October 7th was a disaster because Israel had a lot of the information that should have led them to take preventive actions. And because some of the information was provided to them by these women who were serving in the front line, some of them with emotional issues, the men who were in charge didn’t take these women seriously, and I think this was a situation where sexism contributed to this disaster.

Varda Epstein: Absolutely, absolutely, I’m with you on that.

Alan Dershowitz: By the way, let me add something. I met these women. I went there before this happened, and I sat with them, and they were absolutely incredible. They would be sitting with their television screens, and if they saw a rabbit, they would notice it, if they saw anything, they would notice it. And these were our front line defenses against terrorism, and the men in charge of the very macho Israeli army didn’t take them seriously, and that was kind of a disaster.

Varda Epstein: How do you see the role of AI playing in predicting or preventing harm, especially in legal or national security contexts?

Alan Dershowitz: It’s a double-edged sword. It can help prevent crime because it has this incredible predictive ability based on putting together enormous amounts of information to anticipate what might happen. But AI is itself a potential danger. It can intrude on people’s privacy, it can create its own problems. So I think, on balance, AI is helpful in preventing, but one has to constrain and control every scientific development, including AI.

Varda Epstein: You say that you’ve been thinking about prevention since the 1960s? So, why did you write The Preventive State, now?

Alan Dershowitz: Well, you know, I’ve written articles about it, and I never had, in my own mind, the answers. I had the questions, but I didn’t have the answers, and it took me a long time to think through how to create a jurisprudence. And finally, you know, at age 86, with the benefit of a lot of experience and a little bit of chutzpah, I decided to set out my answers, and so here it is, my magnum opus, my 57th book, for those of us old enough to remember Heinz 57 flavors. So, finally, I was ready, and I think this is my most important book, but of course, the New York Times will not review it because once I defended Donald Trump, they stopped reviewing my books, and they stopped interviewing me mostly. And then they tried to cancel me because they don’t like who my clients are, and so I hope people will read the book on Amazon and learn from it. Even though you can disagree with some of its conclusions, I think you can’t argue with the fact that we live in an increasingly preventive state, and so we have to deal with those issues in a moral and calculated and balanced way.

Varda Epstein: You have an appendix. But it’s the end of your book. Why did you end with a critique of rabbinic law?

Alan Dershowitz: Well it’s not a critique. It’s that rabbinic law goes too far, and so did much classic law, much of which was based on rabbinic law. Went too far, but it asks the right questions. I’m a big fan of rabbinic law, because almost every issue that I taught in my 50 years of teaching at Harvard, the questions had been raised by rabbis and by those who wrote the Torah. But they didn’t always get the answers right. And so I just thought it would be interesting to put in the book ancient sources that gave rise to some of the modern approaches. And I, you know, when I taught at Harvard, I would always introduce rabbinic law and Torah law into my classes, because almost every issue was addressed, which is amazing because they weren’t really in control of an active society. They were writing more in the abstract or for their own community, because, you know, until 1948, there was no country to which to apply Jewish law, that was just a community, but they did a remarkable job in raising these unbelievably complex problems and resolving them.

Varda Epstein: You own a letter from George Washington about urging smallpox inoculation. So, what drew you to that artifact?

Alan Dershowitz: Two things. One, I was writing about this issue, and I wanted to own a piece of history in which Washington not only urges everybody to get inoculated, but as commander-in-chief of the Revolutionary Armed Forces, he commands that, he says, basically, you have to do it, you have to do it quickly, otherwise we can lose the war based on smallpox. Second, the letter is fascinating because it’s signed by George Washington and dictated by George Washington, but the three pages are written by Alexander Hamilton, his secretary. So it has the three things in it. I love the writings of Alexander Hamilton, I’m a great admirer of George Washington, and the concept of prevention is in there, so it worked perfectly.

Varda Epstein: What’s next for Alan Dershowitz? Do you have any other momentous topics to write about?

Alan Dershowitz: Of course, I always do, you know, on the way to being buried, I will probably try to be dictating a final op-ed. I write every single day. I’m writing a book now tentatively entitled Trump to Harvard, Go Fund Yourself. It’s a cute title, and it tries to strike the appropriate balance. I don’t think that the government should be cutting off research funds or funds from scientific, medical, but they should be cutting off funds from the Divinity School, Public Health School, the Carr Center for Human Rights, all of which are incubators for antisemitism. So I want to see targeted defunding and targeted denial of visas. For example, in the 1930s, Harvard loved Nazis, the president of Harvard, Conant, was a Nazi lover, he loved Germany. He brought professors from Nazi Germany and students, and of course the United States said, no, we’re cutting off the visas. Many, many liberals would have applauded that, but they don’t applaud it now, and it’s too broad. We shouldn’t be cutting back on all the visas for all students, but only for the ones that are fomenting dangerous activities on campus and contributing to an atmosphere that led to the death of these two young, wonderful people.

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📚 Book Information

Dershowitz, Alan. The Preventive State: Preempting Cataclysmic Harm while Preserving Fundamental Liberties. New York: Encounter Books, 2024. ISBN: 9781641774401.

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Buy EoZ's books  on Amazon! "He's an Anti-Zionist Too!" cartoon book (December 2024) PROTOCOLS: Exposing Modern Antisemitism (February 2022)

 

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Interview With George Gilder, Author Of The New Edition Of "The Israel Test" (Daled Amos)

By Daled Amos

George Gilder is an American author and economist. His book, The Israel Test, was published in 2009. A new version of the book came out last year.

George Gilder (YouTube screencap)

What is so important about your book, The Israel Test, that it merits a new third edition?

The issues of The Israel Test are imperative for everyone to understand—a relaunch of the message of the essential book of my lifetime. I've been writing for nearly 70 years, and of all my books, I like The Israel Test best. It's the most personal of my books and the most fervent. It may be the most important. I write about entrepreneurship, I write about technology, I write about creativity as the paramount force in human life. It is all epitomized in the fabulous feats of Israel as the Startup Nation and now possibly the leader of the Free World.

I think Israel is transforming the world as we speak.

Briefly, what is the Israel Test?

The test is how people respond to those who excel in creativity, intellect, accomplishment, and wealth. Do you admire them and try to learn from them or do you envy them, resent them, and try to tear them down? This is the central test of the world economy and human life. When we resent those who excel us and attempt to suppress them, we doom our Human Experiment. To the extent that we admire them and emulate them, there are no limits to our achievements on this planet.

For whatever reason, most of the great breakthroughs of the century have come from Jews, and Israel now epitomizes this genius of the Jews. So when we attack Israel, we're really attacking the very source of human creativity and accomplishment in the world. That is the Israel Test.

U.S. corporations have some 70% of the global market cap and all the world's equity markets. When you examine the companies that account for this global leadership in the United States, they all have crucial, laboratories inventions, factories, research, and operations in Israel. People talk about Israel being dependent on the United States. But the U.S. is more dependent on Israel today than Israel is on the U.S. The United States is in a maelstrom at the moment, and Israel is really the inspirational leader of the world economy.

What are the biggest misconceptions about Israel's economy and the Israeli society that you debunk in your book?

First of all, the whole idea that Israel somehow is occupying something is just misconceived.

One of the reasons for the second edition of the book is that once, after I addressed a synagogue in Far Rockaway in New York, fifteen years ago, someone came up to me and gave me a beaten-up, frayed copy of a book by Walter Lowdermilk. That book is the basis for a couple of new chapters in the recent editions of The Israel Test.

Walter Lowdermilk was a Christian in the United States in the Agriculture Department under FDR. A heat wave had led to a terrible drought in the U.S. causing a crisis for US agriculture and for the West. Lowdermilk traveled around the world, in search of agricultural methods to meet this crisis. He ended up in then-Palestine and discovered amazing agricultural feats. This is back in 1938, before the establishment of the state of Israel. He found that the Jews had performed an agricultural miracle unparalleled anywhere else in the world.

Lowdermilk found that they had solved the water problem and made the desert bloom. In time, this led to desalination plants, drip irrigation, microirrigation, and the planting of a million trees. There is now an Israeli university with a Lowdermilk building because he became a hero and is recognized for his important contributions.

He reported that when the Jews moved to Palestine in the 19th century, there were only 200,000 to 300,000 Arabs in this wasteland that was really a desert. Their average lifespan was around 30 years old. When the Jews came and made the desert bloom, the Arabs crowded into Palestine to take advantage of these breakthroughs the Jews achieved. Jewish migration made a population of Palestinians possible. Without the Jewish immigration, there could not have been a sustained population because of the lack of water. Lowdermilk's book documents detailed observations and testimony about how the Jews transformed the desert and made Israel ultimately into the world's most Innovative agricultural country.

But Israel made a big mistake. They adopted socialism. By 1985, Israel was about over, approaching 1000% inflation with the economy on the verge of collapse. The Histadrut domination of banking had resulted in the bankruptcy of banks and the fall of the shekel. That was when the new government under Netanyahu led the transformation of Israel into a capitalist leader.

The real Israel Test came when Israel demonstrated that freedom, capitalism, and creativity enable human life and accomplishment. That vindication of capitalism, pioneered by Netanyahu, changed the Israel Test from a test of recognizing their agricultural changes to recognizing their technological changes. Israel was a key source of the success of Intel Corporation, the leading American semiconductor company. Nvidia achieved great success by buying an Israeli company called Melanox, making Nvidia one of the world's most valuable companies by enabling their Artificial Intelligence breakthroughs.

It begins with half the Nobel prizes and the serious Sciences and it goes on to the richest people in the world, to the most pioneering country in the world. And it's all ultimately a recognition of the incredible genius of the Jews.

The Israel Test is about how Israel's genius enriches the world.

Is the Israel Test of the Arabs different? Aside from the psychological and emotional elements of envy and hatred of the Jews, the Arab world also has a cultural aspect that you mention in your book: shame and honor. Going a step further, are those Arabs living in Israel under Jewish rule for the first time in Arab history being tested and challenged differently than any other people?

Israel is a democratic government that grants Israeli Arabs more rights than any other place in the world, except maybe the United States. Arabs do better in Israel than they do anywhere else. The million Arabs in Israel comprise 16% of all the engineers. The Arabs do well in Israel and do not support Hamas or Hezbollah activities. There are, of course, disgruntled Arabs. But I think that the Arab integration with Israeli Society and Israeli industry has been a lesson for the world and the Israel Test.

I've spent a lot of time in Israel, talking to Arab engineers. They are making crucial contributions. The ones who learn from the Jews rather than resent the Jews do brilliantly in Israel.

You write that capitalism is one of the best remedies for antisemitism. How does that work?

Capitalism is based on giving. A fundamental principle of capitalism is its dependence on the moral fabric that the Jewish and Christian traditions enabled. capitalism is the secret behind the emergence of Israel as the world's leading creative force and its world leadership. Israel did not become the Startup Nation until it adopted capitalism and they didn't employ all these Arabs either until it adopted capitalism.

Probably seven out of the ten richest people in the world are Jews. All their wealth is invested in projects and companies that employ millions of people around the world. This makes the continued triumph over human exigency possible. It explains why the genius of the Jews converges with the capitalist insights to make Israel's emergence as the leader of the West possible. Israel's amazing achievement is that this tiny country has accomplished so much, yet has only existed for 75 years. And it could only have happened with capitalism.

The American economist and political commentator Thomas Sowell makes an important observation. He studied minorities all around the globe. He acknowledges the incredible achievements of the Jews and of Israel as the spearhead. However, he also shows that a similar phenomenon exists in Asia with the overseas Chinese. There are some 40 million overseas Chinese, more overseas Chinese than there are Jews. It's not exactly comparable, but the overseas Chinese dominate the economies of Asia in the same way that Jews dominate the Middle Eastern economy--and the American economy for that matter. Millions of overseas Chinese have been killed in pogroms in Indonesia, for example. This ended up depleting the Indonesian economy for decades They imagined that the overseas Chinese were somehow stealing wealth instead of creating wealth. Wealth is created; it is not stolen.

You write that anti-Semitism withers in wealthy capitalist countries. But is that really true today?

We are slipping back into Socialism. The West is no longer so wealthy and our wealth does not distribute itself as thoroughly as in a free economy. We are socializing our economy in the name of climate change and other delusions that are inducing us to abandon capitalism. When we abandoned capitalism, people began to look for victims. They consider themselves victims and resent the wealthy. They start failing their Israel Test.

So it's not just because we're living post-October 7th?

That's right. Marxism is based on resentment of wealth. If you start resenting and tearing down wealth, you end up failing your Israel Test and bring about catastrophe. And that's our history.

One of the stories I like to tell is about World War II. It was won because the U.S. admitted Jews to lead the Manhattan Project and create the nuclear weapons that made the triumphs of the Western order possible. After the Second World War, democracy and capitalism were the fruit of the Manhattan Project, and the Manhattan Project was accomplished almost entirely by the Jewish scientists fleeing Europe.

John von Neumann is a great hero of the Israel Test. He was a pivotal figure both in the Manhattan Project and in the creation of the computer industry. He won his debate with Albert, Einstein and persuaded Israel to create a supercomputer and acquire nuclear power. Israel could not have survived without von Neumann's contributions. A Jew who fled Europe for the United States ultimately saved both Israel and The United States.

You mention the United States. Generally, antisemitism doesn't seem to be as large a problem here as it is in Europe. Why is that?

One of the reasons is that Europe accepted massive Muslim immigrants without requiring them to adopt the principles of a free society, and without requiring them to abandon their antisemitism. Europe got occupied. It's a terrible problem and it's why Trump's insight about immigration is so critical. You accept immigrants who accept the constitutional principles of your society, the key moral underpinnings of civilized society. An obsession with exterminating Jews is utterly inconsistent with the principles of any kind of free, civilized society. Europe accepted too many jihadists and it's changing their culture.

Eastern Europe is now becoming more prosperous than Western Europe because of this. It is not trivial. Eastern Europe refused Islamic migration and has managed to continue its capitalist prosperity. Poland is now one of the world's most creative and productive countries.

You write that Judaism perhaps more than any other religion favors capitalist activity and provides a rigorous moral framework for it. How so?

Capitalism is based on escape from materialism. It is based on the belief that human beings are created in the image of their Creator. These Judaic insights and principles help explain why Jews lead the world economy.

Is capitalism the escape from materialism? Some say capitalism is dependent on materialism.

No, it absolutely isn't. Many models imagine the economy is dominated by land, energy, resources, rare metals, or whatever claims they make. Actually, ideas are all the world has. As Thomas Sowell puts it, the Neanderthal in his cave had all the material resources that we have today The difference between our age and the Stone Age is entirely the triumph of intellect and ideas and the transcendence over our material bondage and our material entrapment.

What are Israel's biggest challenges in maintaining its economic growth?

Israel led the world in new venture capital in 2024. It grew its venture capital by 38% over 2024 while the U.S. expanded its venture capital, because of the advance of artificial intelligence and the transformative impact of AI on various industries. But even during this horrific war, Israel has expanded its economic leadership. That is why I say they are the leader of the West. They have to maintain their openness, creativity, and inventiveness. They can't retreat to the materialist superstition that wealth comes from the land. Israel demonstrates that wealth doesn't come from the land--it comes from the mind.

What would you like your readers to take away from The Israel Test, especially the younger readers, who may not be familiar with Israel's story?

They should understand that this is a world of abundance. They should be careful not to accept the materialist superstition that ends up resenting wealth by imagining wealth is something material that was stolen from them. And that's the crucial recognition.

We always face the Israel Test. We all have the propensity to envy people who excel us. We all feel that temptation. We must shun the material superstition and embrace the infinite possibilities of the human mind and creativity.

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Buy EoZ's books  on Amazon! "He's an Anti-Zionist Too!" cartoon book (December 2024) PROTOCOLS: Exposing Modern Antisemitism (February 2022)

 

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Dr. Carole Lieberman: “Always Tell Children the Truth About Terror” (Judean Rose, Interview)

Dr. Carole Lieberman, AKA The Terrorist Therapist®, has provided expert advice to readers of my parenting columns since 2016. In all that time, we never met face to face, and I never told her where I lived. It was all by email.

Not long after October 7, however, I decided to tell Dr. Carole that I live in Israel and was worried about my grandchildren, whose home had taken a hit from a rocket on the first day of the war. I even sent her a photo of rockets flying over my son’s home in Netivot in southern Israel.

I guess I just felt a need to connect. Dr. Lieberman’s gig was, after all, terror, and my grandkids had been directly affected. Plus, my Jewdar told me Dr. Carole was a safe place to confide the reality of my life—where I actually live—after working with her remotely all these years.

Carole was quick to offer help. She took my address and told me that her book, Lions and Tigers and Terrorists, Oh My! How to Protect Your Child in a Time of Terror, was on its way to me here in Israel. Now that she knew where I lived, however, Carole wondered if there was something I could do for her.

Lions and Tigers and Terrorists, Oh My! How to Protect Your Child in a Time of Terror (photo: book cover, by permission) 

Dr. Carole Lieberman wanted to find an organization to work with to bring her book and her expertise in terror to Israel to help children and families affected by the war. I was so touched by Dr. Lieberman’s desire to help us—help Israel—in our time of need, and was thankfully able to put her in touch with the right people.

Carole’s book arrived some time later, and I was immediately impressed that it was a beautiful book, bright, colorful, and printed on quality stock—something you don’t often see these days. Then too, the book was well written—frank and filled with good, solid, honest advice. I wanted to review the book for this column. But I wasn’t sure that would be a good move for Carole Lieberman.

I put it to Carole straight: "I want to interview you and review your book, but EOZ is right wing on Israel. Would the politics of this blog space harm you by association? I don't want to negatively impact your book sales."

I sent her some samples of past interviews.

Carole responded, “You don’t have to worry about me being offended by anything right-wing. I am a Trumper all the way. If he doesn’t win it will be a disaster for America and Israel.”

The things you find out about a person after kinda sorta knowing them for almost a decade . . .

***
Varda Epstein: What made you decide to place a focus on terror and children in your professional life? Did you have a mentor who influenced your work—or a body of literature to guide your way? It really seems as if you pioneered this work, at least in the United States.

Carole Lieberman: I’m a born and bred New Yorker, so when 9/11 happened, it broke my heart because, although I had moved to California, my heart was still in New York – and so was my daughter. She gave me a minute-by-minute description of what was happening – from the gray smoke that drifted all the way from lower Manhattan’s World Trade Center-Twin Towers to the upper tip of Manhattan where she was attending Barnard College. While the tragedy was happening, I was overcome by a strong sense, a premonition perhaps, that terrorism was going to be the worst threat that the world would have to cope with and I asked myself, ‘What can I do – as a psychiatrist, author, talking head in the media - to help?’ From this, I formed the concept of devoting myself to work as The Terrorist Therapist® and have continued doing this to this day. I did not really know much about terrorism when I began, but I quickly began attending conferences and have been researching and studying it ever since.

My work has evolved quite a bit since 9/11 and taken me on a journey of a lifetime. I am honored to do this work because no one else has ventured this deeply into helping people and warning them about terrorists’ jihadi goals – especially not since America has become so ‘woke’ and some consider it offensive to tell it like it is – by calling ISIS, Al Qaeda and other terrorist groups “terrorists.”

I started by creating an audio-video program that was played on airlines’ inflight entertainment to relax passengers who had become nervous after the four planes attacked America on 9/11. I used guided imagery and called it “Shrink on Board.”

Since then, in addition to working 1 on 1 with people, I’ve written two books on terrorism; host a podcast called “The Terrorist Therapist Show;” do media interviews; and speaking engagements. I also created a music video that I play on a mobile billboard going around Manhattan and Washington D.C. each 9/11 anniversary, to remind people about the tragedy and terrorism in general; how to talk to kids about it; psychological symptoms of Post-Traumatic Stress Disorder; how terrorists are determined to create global jihad; and how those who forget history are doomed to repeat it.

Dr. Carole's mobile billboard

Varda Epstein: You’re based in California. How many children are you currently working with who have experienced terror, either firsthand or second hand? Can you give us some idea of what these children have gone through and how it affects them? What is the age range of the children you work with?

Carole Lieberman: As a psychiatrist, I do therapy with children, teens and adults in California and New York – since I am licensed in both states. I’ve also helped families in London and Paris, in regard to the trauma they feel from their terror attacks. I’ve lived in these cities, so it was especially heartbreaking to see the damage terrorists had done. London’s “9/11” was their 2005 attacks on the Tube and on one of their iconic double-decker buses. My first book about terrorism, Coping with Terrorism: Dreams Interrupted, was published by a London publisher in 2006, as the 1^st anniversary edition of 7/7. I spent two weeks in London, when the book came out and helped families, especially those who had lost loved ones in this attack, to heal. When my second book about terrorism, Lions and Tigers and Terrorists, Oh My! How to Protect Your Child in a Time of Terror, won an award from the London Book Festival, I returned to London and went to Manchester as well, because there had been a terror attack on the concert hall there. I met with people in a floating bookstore on the Thames; libraries; cafés; and at Anna Freud’s Hampstead Clinic, where I had studied years ago. I helped families process the increasing threat of terrorism and found that children were especially hungry for an opportunity to talk about their feelings and to hear the truth instead of being told not to worry about it. Grownups were surprised at their questions: how much they knew, how many misconceptions they had, and – how eagerly they expressed their feelings, despite the usual British stiff-upper lip.

Paris has suffered several terror attacks. Their ‘9/11’ was the 2015 attack on Le Stade soccer stadium, restaurants, bars, and Le Bataclan concert venue. When Lions and Tigers and Terrorists won the Paris Book Festival, it was another opportunity for me to help, since I spoke French. I went to a concert at the Bataclan to try to better understand what it was like for the audience when they were attacked. It was chilling to see that they were easy prey for the terrorists because it was like ‘shooting fish in a barrel.’ I met with people at the Café Bataclan who were clearly still traumatized. I met with teachers at a school; a parents’ group; librarians; and doctors at the American Hospital in Paris, encouraging them to express their feelings about terrorism. I also met with a group of writers at Shakespeare and Company, the iconic French bookstore on the Left Bank. It was fascinating and rewarding to talk with so many different people about the impact of terrorism on their lives. Parisians are very proud of their beautiful ‘City of Light,’ so they were pained, not only by the deaths and injuries, but by the destruction of their surroundings.

As the years since 9/11 have passed, many Americans who weren’t living near the sites of the attacks in New York City, Washington D.C., or Pennsylvania have pushed their memories of that day into their unconscious mind or gone into denial. So, patients in America don’t necessarily say that 9/11 is the reason they’re coming into therapy. Yet, the problems they have – depression, anxiety, Post-Traumatic Stress Disorder, and so on – have a connection to 9/11. It is always fascinating to see how that date coincided with something significant in their lives, in addition to the attack.

Depending upon the age of the children, teens and young adults who I work with currently, they either weren’t born yet by 9/11, or were children during that time and in the aftermath. What has been most striking and very worrisome is the powerful and lasting impact of terror attacks. Even if the person wasn’t alive at the time of the attack, but they were raised by parents who were alive then, they absorb the “terror” from their parents by osmosis. In other words, the trauma that the parents experienced gets inadvertently communicated to their children and makes them feel fearful of the outside world; feel more amenable to having “Big Brother” take care of them; and feel less ambitious because they have a sense of uncertainty and impending doom. These effects can be mitigated by parents and families who recognize these dangers and actively seek to soothe and counteract them.

Speaking at Route 91 Survivors (Las Vegas shooting) on recovering from trauma

Varda Epstein: Tell us something about your book, Lions and Tigers and Terrorists, Oh My! How is it structured—is it for parents or for children? Can you talk about the use of The Wizard of Oz as a frame of reference, or metaphor for terror?

Carole Lieberman: My book, Lions and Tigers and Terrorists, Oh My! How to Protect Your Child in a Time of Terror, was written to help grownups talk to their kids about terrorism and to help kids learn the truth about terrorism without feeling terrified.

The first half of the book, for parents and teachers, answers kids’ most common questions (including the ones they don’t ask aloud); provides guidelines for how to make kids become more resilient; and how to process the experience of terrorism so that it leaves the least scars. Too many grownups are afraid to talk to their kids about it because they say they, “don’t want to scare them.” But they don’t realize that kids have seen and heard so much about terrorism that already scares them because they don’t understand it. They get snippets of news and may even have seen an attack at their front door. Their friends tell them stories, too, and it all becomes a muddle of confusion. Kids can handle a lot if grownups explain it to them calmly and provide a way for them to digest it. The most important role that parents can play is to get kids to express their feelings so that they don’t just swallow them and develop psychological problems later on. The grownups part of the book concludes with 88 ideas that parents and teachers can do with kids to help them grow up healthy and happy, despite it being a time of terror.

The second half of the book is an interactive picture book for kids. This is best read together with a grownup, so that kids can ask questions as they go along. For example, in answer to the question, “What is a terrorist?” the book shows a picture of a bully on the playground with the words, “A terrorist is like a big bully on the playground,” and goes on to explain more.

Before the page with Osama Bin Laden’s picture, kids are asked to draw what they imagine a real terrorist looks like. There are pictures of terrorists in the Middle East, too, along with answers to why terrorists are trying to hurt people. There are opportunities for kids to draw how they’re feeling and point to emojis that match their feelings; draw their “safe place” and so on. The children’s part of the book concludes with 10 lessons or activities kids can do to make themselves safer.

The overall idea is to turn homes and classrooms into more nurturing and comforting nests to nourish and develop kids into more resilient beings who can cope with terrorism.

The Wizard of Oz is the story from which the book title comes. It describes Dorothy, the Tin Man, and the Scarecrow skipping off to find the Wizard. When night falls, the forest becomes a scary place, especially when the Tin Man says they might meet “lions and tigers and bears.” But, since they each want to ask the Wizard for something important, they find the courage within themselves to continue, now singing, “Lions and tigers and bears, Oh My!” The Tin Man wants a heart, the Scarecrow wants brains, and Dorothy wants to go home. Later, the Lion joins their quest because he wants courage. So, the moral of the story is that we each have enough heart, brains and courage to see us through scary times and there’s “No place like home.”

Carole in Paris, helping teachers talk about terrorism with their students

Varda Epstein: Do you think the experience of terror is universal? Do children in the United States, for example, experience terror differently, and if so, how so? Are their needs in the aftermath of terror different?

Carole Lieberman: To some degree, the experience of terror is universal, but different societies raise children with different tolerances and strengths to withstand it. For example, in America these days, many children are coddled too much and aren’t given enough opportunities to build character by being put into character-building situations – such as learning to be independent in summer sleepaway camps. The more challenges children have, that they are helped to overcome, the more confidence they have in themselves for dealing with future challenges – including terrorism. The only caveat to this is that children who already have psychological problems before terror attacks are often less able to cope with the added stress of terror. In the aftermath, every child needs a loving support system to see them through.

"The Terrorist Therapist®" on Good Morning Britain 

Varda Epstein:  Your book, published in 2017, tells parents to “teach tolerance.” You write, for example, “Explain that most Muslims, believers in Islam, are not terrorists or ‘bad guys.’ They want to live peaceful lives, too.” Do you still believe this, even in the wake of what happened on October 7, when ordinary Gazans and UNRWA teachers joined in the rape, sexual violence, and massacre of peaceful Israelis? How can one know that most Muslims are not terrorists? Are there statistics? Is this a helpful thing to teach Israeli children as well as American children?

Carole Lieberman: It is very tricky to walk the fine line of not teaching kids to be Islamophobic while giving them a true picture of Muslims and Radical Islamist terrorists. All Muslims have the potential to be or become Radical Islamists because they believe in the Koran to a greater or lesser extent and most belong to a mosque. In America there are fewer madrassas than in the Middle East, so there are fewer children who are taught to become terrorists from the time they are toddlers. Israel, on the other hand, is surrounded by countries that do have madrassas which teach children that the holiest life they could lead, and for which they would be rewarded in the afterlife, is to devote themselves to destroying Israel and killing Jews. This puts Israel in greater danger.

Certainly, there have not been many Muslims – anywhere in the world - who have spoken out against terrorists and terror attacks, so they seem to be giving tacit approval by quietly condoning them. Still, there are Muslims who don’t approve and want peace. It’s safe to say that, “Not all Muslims are terrorists, and not all terrorists are Muslim.”

It's hard to know percentages as to how many Muslims are radical Islamists. Some radical Islamists can be said to “misinterpret” the Koran in a way that gives them the right to kill Jews or even encourages them to kill Jews. Radical Islamists claim that they are not “misinterpreting” the Koran – but that all Muslims are commanded by Allah to not only destroy Israel and Jews, but to perpetrate global jihad against ALL infidels – Jews, Christians, anyone who doesn’t worship Allah as their only God.

Of course, it is hard to explain why children (or adults) in Israel should not be terrified of all Muslims, no less open their hearts to them, after October 7. The terrorists acted like primitive animals, driven by their religious zeal, believing that they were doing the most honorable acts – even as they were raping and murdering. But, on the other hand, Israelis and American Jews have the most open hearts on earth, so it is not good to teach them to harden their heart to anyone, but rather to be very careful.

 

Dr. Lieberman is a highly sought talk show guest for her expertise on children and terror

Varda Epstein: Reading your book after October 7, while Israel still has captives in Gaza, I found myself nodding at some parts of your book, while other parts distressed me, because they didn’t seem like they made sense for the children directly affected by Israel’s “Black Sabbath.”

This part, for example:

Child: What will happen to me if you don't come to pick me up at school or you don't come home? What if you get hurt?

Parent: you don't have to worry about being left alone to take care of yourself. If you are at school, the teachers will take care of you until someone from our family or one of our adult friends comes to pick you up. If I don't come home because I am hurt, then someone in our family or one of our adult friends will come home to take care of you. I will be in a doctor's office or in the hospital getting well. If you ever get scared because I am not where you think I am supposed to be, then ask a teacher, or your babysitter, or some other adult taking care of you, if you can call me. If you can't reach me, then call the people on the list of family and friends we made together. These people will take good care of you. You will always have someone to love you, no matter what happens.

Things didn’t exactly play out this way for the children of Be’eri, Nir Oz, Kfar Aza, and other places that came under attack. What should Israeli parents be telling their children to do if their mommies don’t pick them up from school or don’t come home because they are being held hostage in Gaza? What do you tell Israeli children who saw atrocities visited on their siblings, parents, and neighbors?

Carole Lieberman: Although it is true that many of the children of Be’eri, Nir Oz, Kfar Aza and other places that came under attack lost parents and siblings, and were plunged into chaos on October 7, they were eventually rescued by friends, family, or social agencies who tried to comfort them and help them get back to as normal a life as possible. These children who saw atrocities and lost loved ones will be more traumatized than children in parts of Israel that were not attacked. The best way to help them is to gently get them to express their feelings – not to hold them in, and to provide food, shelter and caring people around them, as well as a simple and steady routine of school, mealtimes, bedtimes, and so on.

 

At Bataclan in Paris

Varda Epstein: Is there a right or wrong way to teach children about a loved one’s death due to terror? For example, on October 7, there were children whose parents and/or siblings were killed or brutalized in other ways in front of them. How can we explain to them why this happened, or the nature of what happened, and why it had to happen in front of them? Is there a way to make them feel safe going forward?

Carole Lieberman: The way to teach children about a loved one’s death due to terror will depend upon the age and psychological maturity of the child. If they are younger than 7 or 8 or so, they are not usually able to understand the permanency of death. If a child saw their loved one killed, in some ways it is easier to explain death, but harder to erase the memory of how they died. Ask them what they believe happens to someone after they die. If what they believe comforts them, such as their mommy or daddy being up on a cloud in heaven, listening to angels play harps and eating chocolate-covered macaroons, there’s no reason to take this away from them. It’s especially helpful to point out signs that their loved one is still with them in spirit, such as when they see something that had special significance to their loved one – like an animal or poem, or when something good happens to them. If possible, it’s comforting for them to carry with them a photograph, an article of clothing, or something else that belonged to their loved one. It’s important to encourage the children to talk about good memories they have of their loved ones, and to write these down in a diary, so that they can think of the good memories whenever the bad memory of their death comes to their mind.

You can explain that the people who brutalized or killed their loved one were driven by a false belief that they were going to be rewarded for killing people who don’t believe in the same religion that they do – radical Islam. For some, you can explain that terrorists were taught from the time that they were little, in schools called madrassas, that their goal in life should be to kill all the people who don’t believe in their god, Allah, and to start with Israel first. It wasn’t because their loved one was bad or did anything to deserve being killed. If it happened in front of them, it was because this gave the cruel terrorists pleasure and they wanted to warn others that they had better follow their rules in the future.

To reassure these children, you can tell them about all the people, organizations, the IDF and so on, who are working to keep them safe all the time. It often helps to tell them that their lost loved one has become their guardian angel and will try to guide them to keep safe.

Varda Epstein: There was a recent story about a social worker who stayed on the phone with the Idan children (ages 6 and 9, the siblings of released 4-year-old hostage Abigail) for 12 hours as they hid in a closet from terrorists who had infiltrated their kibbutz on October 7. Their mother had been murdered and her body was right outside the closet door. How would you grade this social worker’s performance? 

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A post shared by United Hatzalah of Israel (@unitedhatzalahofisrael)

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A post shared by United Hatzalah of Israel (@unitedhatzalahofisrael)

The Idan children hid on the shelves on this closet for 12 hours until they were rescued, with their mother's body right outside the door.

Carole Lieberman: I think this social worker did an excellent job of keeping the Idan children comforted and safe. Her instincts told her when they shouldn’t open the door to terrorists or be seen by them from the window. She also realized how important it was for the phone to have enough charge to keep her connected as their lifeline. She made sure that the little boy was able to bear the sight of his deceased mother, who he would have to see if he made his way to get the charger. She kept her voice calm and soothing and promised that she would stay with them until they got rescued, which turned out to be 12 hours later. But she kept her promise.

Book talk at the Hollywood Book Festival

Varda Epstein: How should Israeli parents talk to their children about October 7th and the hostage situation? What can we say or do for children whose loved ones are still held hostage? For very young children, is it better to distract them from the subject of an absent, hostage parent or sibling, or is it preferable to help keep their memories of these loved ones, alive? 

Carole Lieberman: It is important not to pretend that a child’s loved one, who is still being held hostage, hasn’t been taken by Hamas. On the other hand, this isn’t something that needs to be spoken about 24/7. Children can be comforted by knowing that there is still a chance that their loved one may survive and be returned to them, as they have seen in the news happen for other families. Of course, they want to know why their parent or sibling hasn’t returned, but at least there is still hope. It’s important to reassure them that their loved one isn’t choosing to be away from them, but that the “bad people,” the terrorists, are holding onto them to try to get what they want from Israel.

Families should not promise children that their loved one will absolutely return home in case this doesn’t happen. But you can keep a photo or an object that brings back memories of the hostage in a visible place, and pray together for their safe return. You can also ask the child to talk about what they would like to do with their loved one when they get back. The most important thing is to get the child to express their feelings: sadness, anger, longing, hope, and so on.

Varda Epstein: Should all Israeli children, in general, be considered to be affected by terror? What should Israeli parents be on the watch for with their children? What are the warning signs that a child affected by terror needs help from a mental health professional? 

Carole Lieberman: All Israeli children are affected by terror – whether they have seen it up close and personal, or in the media, or have just absorbed the terror from those around them. Some children won’t show it and will try to pretend that nothing is different or wrong, especially if they get the message from others that they’re not supposed to talk about it.

Terror often makes children regress, behaving as they did when they were much younger. For example, they may wet the bed, be afraid of the dark, or suck their thumb. It’s important not to shame them for these signs that they need more comforting. If these behaviors persist, they need help from a mental health professional.

The four basic reactions children have to terror are feeling scared, sad, mad, or bad. It’s natural to feel scared after October 7, but parents need to be on the lookout for symptoms that this has progressed from reasonable fear to more serious anxiety, obsessive-compulsive disorder, or Post-Traumatic Stress Disorder. It’s also natural for children to feel sad, knowing terrorists have hurt people or taken them as hostages, but parents need to be aware that this can turn into more serious depression. It’s also natural for children to feel mad about what happened on October 7, and that their life has still not been able to return to normal. But parents should get professional help if their child starts acting out their anger. Feeling bad happens when children can’t distinguish exactly how they feel. They feel a muddle of scared, sad, mad and perhaps other emotions, too. If their confusion and malaise persists, they, too may need professional help.

Book launch at the National Press Club in Washington, D.C.

Varda Epstein: What about the Israeli children who were held captive, and then released? What should we expect to see, and how can they be helped? Will they ever experience complete healing—is that possible?

Carole Lieberman: The Israeli children who were held captive and then released will have psychological scars, the gravity of which will depend upon their age, their psychological stability before they were held captive, and how they were treated in Hamas captivity. Of course, they’ll be happy and excited to return to their families, but this should not be interpreted as their having no scars. All of them need to be in intensive psychotherapy – at least for a few years – depending upon the severity of their trauma. The biggest risk, when families are so thrilled to have them come home, is to overlook the deeper wounds inside and pretend that everything will be okay just because they’re back home. These children won’t want to worry their families by telling them about the worst atrocities they’ve experienced as hostages. So, they need a professional therapist to gradually allow them to talk about it, or to express their feelings through play therapy, and eventually heal.

Varda Epstein: I have heard it said, even before October 7, that there is not a person in Israel who is not suffering from PTSD as a result of terror, even when the terror is only something they hear about or read about happening to others. Do you think there is any truth to this idea? 

Carole Lieberman: In America, studies show that people who weren’t anywhere near sites of 9/11 attacks, but who watched news reports of that day over and over again on television, developed PTSD. So, it is likely that there’s not a person in Israel who is not suffering from some degree of PTSD as a result of terror, even when the terror is only something they hear about or read about happening to others. This is especially true for those Israelis who have endured many terror threats and attacks beginning way before October 7th.

Varda Epstein: How should parents talk to kids about terror? What are some common misperceptions children may have about terror and how can we help clarify things for them in a helpful way?

Carole Lieberman: The two most important things that parents must remember when talking to kids about terror are to tell them the truth (though softening the roughest parts is allowed, especially for young children), and to prioritize getting them to talk about their feelings, so that they don’t swallow them and hold them inside, or else they’ll have psychological problems down the road.

The most damaging misperception that children have about terrorism is that they, their family or their country as a whole, must have done something wrong to deserve the punishment dished out by terrorists. This is why it’s important to explain that terrorists are taught - from the time they are toddlers - to hate everyone who doesn’t believe in their God, Allah, and to wage war (jihad) on them. Grownups need to reassure children that there are many people who are aware of this and who work every day to protect them.

Route91Strong Anniversary Fundraiser For Victims Of The October 1st, 2017 Las Vegas Shooting, with Lisa Vanderpump

Varda Epstein: What advice can you offer to Israeli parents and children at this difficult time?

Carole Lieberman: Israelis have some advantages over Americans when it comes to coping with terrorism. For one thing, Israeli children are raised to value becoming resilient. For another thing, there is a stronger appreciation of God than in some American homes. It is comforting to remember that God has always looked out for Israel and Jewish people. He is more powerful than terrorists. With His help, you can turn all the evil that has happened, from October 7^th on, into something good: making your home an even more loving and nurturing nest that provides even more comfort and strength for all family members. Am Yisrael Chai.

***

Carole Lieberman, M.D., M.P.H. is a Board-Certified Beverly Hills psychiatrist who treats patients; testifies at trials as an expert witness; and is a regular, three-time Emmy Award-winning guest on such top TV shows as Oprah, the Today Show, Good Morning America, CNN, FOX News, HLN, ET, ABC, CBS, NBC, Oxygen, Court TV, and Law and Crime. Lieberman received her training at NYU-Bellevue and at Anna Freud's London Clinic and has served on the Clinical Faculty of UCLA's Neuropsychiatric Institute. She hosts “Dr. Carole’s Couch” on VoiceAmerica and the “Terrorist Therapist Show” podcast.

Known worldwide as The Terrorist Therapist®, Dr. Lieberman is also the bestselling award-winning author of four books, two of them on terror. Dr. Lieberman’s book, the first of its kind on children and terror, can be purchased on Amazon at the following link: Lions and Tigers and Terrorists, Oh My! How to Protect Your Child in a Time of Terror

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